If we took two extremes - Union/NYC on the one side, very low-key, very subtle and BWS/Tokyo, very tech and upscale, where would you see SURRENDER ? JL: I don't know whether it is in the middle because it is kind of high-tech, but it's not so clean in that way. I mean it's not like The Hideout or Union; it's not so organic so I suppose it lends itself more to Bathing Ape or Japan. If Bathing Ape was Yin and Union would be Yang then it would be a little bit of both, but it's dark. What I loved about those Japanese shops was the whole... and it doesn't exist so much at the moment, but at the time when it first started happening was this whole period of discovery, and of having to go there, and it not being so obvious. That's something that was really important to the way we did the shop. JL: That's why we put it in the mall in Far East Plaza, which is kind of street, and it's not expensive, and it's a bit dirty and a bit fucked up. It's not high-tech - not near the Louis Vuitton store... I mean it's next to a fucking brothel! And that's the allure ? JL: I don't want it so elitist that you have to ring the bell to get in - I like Lara's shop on Hoxton - she designs jewellery, and it's a bit more underground, and it's like you've discovered something. I just felt with this place it was more important to kind of keep it in a more youthful environment, and a slightly more street environment, but do something more high-tech and mental - but try and do something that is more of an experience.